Month: November 2016

The high C-rate is not the only reason LiPo is adored by the high performance crowd, the addition of Cobalt to the cathode meant that more power would fit in a smaller package. This was driven by the boom in Radio-Controlled (RC) models in the late 1990’s (RC airplanes, cars, helicopters, etc). When that market suddenly expanded, an Australian enthusiast started a company to supply RC parts from factories in China. Hobby King.com was born. Last year, due to popular demand, HK has opened warehouses in The USA and in Germany (edit: even more countries have HK warehouses now).

It is possible to do it that way, however there are some compelling reasons not to. 1) By first joining all the series cells you would end up with multiple high voltage groups, which means both the chance and consequences of an accident are greater. When you’re working with lots of exposed batteries with nickel conductors and metal tools flying around, the last thing you want is more high voltage possibilities for shorts. 2) Doing series cells first would be come unwieldy, physically. A series group is only connected at either the top or bottom of alternating cells. Without having multiple cells side by side to add stability, a long chain of single cells will need either a pile of glue or some type of physical holder to support the chain. and 3) most battery spot welders can only reach about 2 cells deep into a pack, meaning you’d have to either add very short nickel strips to each series group connecting only two groups (which means twice the welding and twice the cell damaging heat) or have long uncontrolled nickel strips hanging off the sides, again risking shorting.

The article was extremely informative, thank you. I’ve found everything but am struggling with good cells. At Aliexpress there are many choices but I’m struggling to get near the $2/cell mark you mentioned as a limit for decent cells and still find performance criteria of a good battery (or at all). So far I’ve found NCR18650B but it appears to have a 2C discharge rating for a 3400mA cell. At 4P this is more than enough but seems low for LiIon so I wonder if it is good? The price is $163 shipped to USA for 10s 4p 40 pieces to make 36v 13.6Ah. After adding shrink wrap, BMS and nickle strips I’m at $213 before buying a spot welder ($200). I can buy on the same site a 36v 15Ah Li Ion pack for $248. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/US-EU-No-Tax-DIY-lithium-18650-battery-pack-15AH-36V-Electric-Bike-battery-for-36V/32757165516.html?spm=2114.13010208.99999999.274.JmcpBS

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The controller that came with my ebike conversion kit just has the label ’48v 1000w’ on it and there are no other specifications anywhere to be seen. I have emailed the suppliers asking if I could have a full list of specifications for the controller but am yet to hear back from them.

Your battery pack size is based on voltage and amp-hours. The higher the voltage and the higher the amp hours of your battery, the more range your battery will give you. A 48V 10-Ah pack gives you 480 watt hour (48 X 10). This gives you an easy way to determine exactly how much battery you are buying. The wattage of a battery is the only accurate determinant to judge what range your finished ebike will have.

While it is possible to build packs with any number of cells for just about any voltage, most have standardized in 12V increments, with 24V, 36V, and 48V being most common, and 72V used on occasion. Battery chargers are usually only stocked for these voltages as well.

This page is embarrassingly old, referencing chemistries that are completely obsolete, and is due for a rewrite. In the meantime, we recommend checking out our Battery Kits Product Info page for a more current explanation on lithium specific battery packs.

Hailong makes some of the more refined of the generic battery enclosures from china. You’ll see them online everywhere, stuffed with whatever cells and BMS circuit appropriate to the market being addressed. They secure to the water bottle eyelets on the down tube of your bike frame, and the narrow height of this pack design allows it to fit even on smaller or hybrid frame geometries that wouldn’t normally fit a pack. We have the smaller Hailong-01 enclosure in 36V (10s 5p) and 52V (14s 4p) layouts suitable for 20-25A current setups, and the larger Hailong-03 enclsoure in 36V 23.5Ah (10s 7p) and 52V 16.5Ah(14s 5p) sizes for higher current and capacity. 

Electric bikes in the UK tend to come with either Lithium Ion (Li-Ion) or Lithium Polymer (LiPo) batteries. In China, on the other hand, lead acid batteries are still the most common ones used. In 2014 – according to the China Bicycle Association / IdTechEx  – 35 million eBikes were sold on the Chinese market, and just 2.8 million of them had lithium battery.

I have now come to the conclusion however that i want a pack that is 48V and capable of running a 1000w motor for atleast an hour. I live in a hilly area, i use a downhill bike (heavy) and im not the smallest guy. Im feeling a bit insecure about putting too many cells in parallel. Through the years i’ve read that the consesus is that more than 4 cells in parallel is a risk. Since a 13S4P pack is about 12Ah (with good batteries) i was wondering if you had any input on how i should move on?

Thanks! I’m putting together a new rig I need to tow a 50lb trailer over some soft sand…I’m realizing the proper system is paramount. Any recommendations for power/battery/controllers? DIY eBikes website?

Safety disclaimer: Before we begin, it’s important to note that lithium batteries inherently contain a large amount of energy, and it is therefore crucial to handle them with the highest levels of caution. Building a DIY lithium battery requires a basic understanding of battery principles and should not be attempted by anyone lacking confidence in his or her electrical and technical skills. Please read this article in its entirety before attempting to build your own ebike battery. Always seek professional assistance if needed.

Believe it or not, most BMS’s can handle the current from regenerative braking in the discharge mosfets as its rarely more than 5-7A. Some BMS’s (called two wire BMS’s) actually use the same mosfets for charging and discharging. Those inherently should be more than capable of dealing with the load from regen.

I have come to the conclusion that a 48v battery would probabky be sufficent for my needs. I need to ride continuously for at least 7-8 hours–but prefer up to 10 hours– at 15-20mph everyday. Although I also need a top speed of 30mph, at times. If my math is right, in order to accomplish this I need to build at least a 14s8p battery. After running these specs through a simulator I found that the power starts to drop at about 1150 watts and 20mph.

Hey Brian, good question. You can actually do regenerative braking this way, the only problem is that you won’t be using the balancing circuit part of the BMS as it will charge straight back through the discharge circuit. Theoretically this is fine, with the exception of one specific case where this could be a problem. If you charged your battery at the top of a huge hill and then immediately rolled down that hill for a long time while using regenerative braking, you could actually overcharge the battery. That scenario is pretty rare though.

12V increments are easier to do with LiFePO4 due to the 3.2V per cell. So for 12V, 24V, 36V and 48V they go 4 cells, 8 cells, 12 cells and 16 cells. Li-ion is more annoying because the 3.7V per cell doesn’t play as nicely. The general convention for the same 12V increments is 3 cells, 7 cells, 10 cells, and 13 or 14 cells. 3 cells is just a bit low for a 12V system (about 11V nominal) but will work for most applications until the voltage drops to about 9.5 or 10V depending on your device’s cutoffs. Regarding the balancing issue, if you’re using those packs that claim to remain in balance then I’d imagine you can just trust them. If their packs had problems with balance then they’d probably be having tons of returns. Worst come to worst you can occasionally open the case and measure the cells to make sure they are all staying balanced. One word of advice: be very careful with the series/parallel switch setup. If you make a mistake or the switch melts you could end up shorting your batteries electrical and ruin the whole lot…

This is how most Asian batteries are built, since they use the same size aluminum or plastic case, but offer different sizes and capacities of batteries in the same case. I’ve used arts and craft foam, which often comes in sheets up to about 5mm thick (and I use a few layers to fill larger gaps). For MUCH larger gaps where that thin foam is less desirable, I’ve seen people use styrofoam or even that green molding foam often used in pots to hold up fake plants. That stuff is a fairly rigid though, so maybe a combination of that stuff and a layer of softer foam for cushioning would be good.

Panasonic and Samsung are the only manufacturers I know of that are producing this chemistry (several other manufacturers buy these and re-label them as their own). Since you would have to buy the bare cells in order to solder together your own pack, I wouldn’t have mentioned these just yet, but…EBAY-seller supowerbattery111 is selling these, and…he will also professionally spot-weld the cells into groups for a small fee, which reduces your pack-building efforts down to about 1/10th of what it would be otherwise. His main business seems to be refurbishing cordless tool battery packs that have worn out.

I then put one set of welds on each cell end of the first parallel group, effectively tacking the three nickel strips in place. Then I added another set of welds on each of the negative terminals of the second parallel group. This gave me 6 weld sets, or one weld set for each cell. Lastly, I followed up those single weld sets with another couple welds per cell to ensure good contact and connection.

Thanks so much for this excellent information. I was wondering how to calculate the total amps for the entire battery? I’m trying to determine watts from this as I have a 24V 500 watt Rayos electric bike and am working to build a 24V 20 Ah battery (7s7p) battery and would like to know what watts it is capable of providing.

I am working on a similar project, and was wondering if the BMS’s that you recommended would handle any back EMF from the motor (from regenerative braking, for example.) I see that there are separate leads for charging and discharging, so I’m guessing if current flowed back through the discharge circuit that would be bad. Do you have any recommendations on a BMS (or something different) that would handle this condition?

If those are new cells then I’m surprised that the voltages aren’t identical. That difference (0.08V) is about the farthest difference I’d want to see between cells. Ideally you should charge that 3.82V cell up a bit more before you connect it in parallel with the others. I’d run tests on all of those cells though with a capacity tester to ensure they are good quality cells though. Genuine cells straight from the factory should all have identical voltages.

Thanks for your kind words about my article, I’m glad it helped! To answer your question, I highly recommend avoiding a custom built charger. While it might be possible to use a DC-DC converter to change the output voltage of your 12V charger, the chances of a problem occurring are too high for my liking. The converter might not be smart enough to adjust the current down once full charge is reached. Technically your BMS should protect your battery from most overcharging scenarios, but if it is overloaded and a component fails, there is nothing to stop your cells from being destroyed.

We also maintain stock of replacement vertical seattube batteries that have been in use in the eZee bicycle line since time immemorial. If you have an eZee bike circa 2008-2012 with the Phylion lithium battery pack, you’ll be in for a serious upgrade with over twice the capacity in the same size and weight.

Secondly, what is your take on modular plastic battery spacers (e.g. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/50x-EV-Pack-Plastic-Heat-Holder-Bracket-Battery-Spacer-18650-Radiating-Shell-New/351681365193?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D36381%26meid%3Dfc487881e617412ba361731154a742b5%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D262123820960). Clearly this adds a significant volume penalty and a smaller weight / cost one, but if this is not an issue then how would you rate vs glueing? I can see the benefit of having a space between the cells to limit heat / electrical conductivity in the event of some kind of melt down, but any thoughts?

I’d recommend going with a cell that can output 10A, giving you 40A continuous power rating. You’ll use less than that, meaning the cells will be happier (and cooler). Something like the Sanyo 18650GA or LG MJ1 would give you good power and capacity (both are around 3,400 mAH per cell).

I want to build some custom batteries, but I am hesitant to do the spot welding myself. Aren’t there modular and affordable pieces of hardware one can use to connect the batteries? Something like this?

Technically yes, you can bypass the BMS for discharging and just charge through the BMS but this is not recommended. It is better to just choose a BMS that can handle your 50A discharge. BesTechPower makes some great BMS units that can handle 50A and more, depending on the model. They have many options.

You too can find a metal box to store your batteries in while riding and charging.  Here is an example of a custom built metal box that holds six hobby king packs perfectly (make certain to add a vent so pressure does not build up if a pack goes into flames!):

The main limitation of those holders is power – they can’t handle it. For a few amps, they might be fine, but ebikes require dozens of amps, which would surely melt those guys. Think about it this way: professional ebike batteries have big hunks of nickel plate welded between cells. The tiny little spring contacts of those holders will never compare to that kind of current carrying ability.

The SLA electric bike battery is a reliable power source for electric bikes that are used for shorter trips. The best lifespan for an SLA battery is obtained by keeping it fully charged as much as possible, and discharging it only to half its actual capacity. It’s an affordable electric bike battery, ideal for round trips of 5 to 8 miles, when it can be recharged right away. In typical electric bike use, SLA electric bike batteries last about a year, but longer life is possible if the use is very light, and the battery is kept fully charged at all times.

HERE ARE 50 GENIUNE MOLI ICR-18650H 18650 CELLS. THESE WERE TESTED IN ONE OF OUR LIITOKALA TESTING STATIONS AND THESE ARE ALL BETWEEN 1201-1400MAH! THEY ARE UL LISTED CELLS AND MANUFACTURED IN CANADA …

Great for DIY e-bike and powerwall builders, t ake them apart and put them all together in series in other projects and get extreme power out of what you build! These batteries are made with TWENTY (2…

This is our smallest battery offering specifically aimed at people who have to travel or fly with their ebike. Each module is 36V 2.7Ah, so just under 100 watt-hours, exempting it from most of the heavy shipping restrictions. You can parallel connect them for as much capacity as required, and series connect them for 72V setups. Designed and made in Canada by Grin Tech, full details here.

Now I’ve got all of my pack sealed in heat shrink with my wires exiting the seam between the two layers of shrink wrap. I could have stopped here, but I didn’t particularly like the way the shrink fell on the wire exit there, from a purely aesthetic standpoint. So I actually took a third piece of shrink wrap, the same size (285 mm) as that first piece and went around the long axis of the pack one more time to pull the wires down tight to the end of the pack.

Lithium Battery technology in a bicycle is still experimental and you have to use a lot of common sense when using these batteries. However with a little education and some end user carefulness, you can use lithium batteries safely, the same as you can safely deal with putting gasoline in your riding lawn mower.

2. I highly recommend using a BMS in both Li-ion and LiFePO4 batteries. As a Li-ion vs LiFePO4 question, one isn’t necessarily better than the other. Li-ion will be cheaper and probably more powerful, but LiFePO4 is going to last years longer, so it’s all about what you want in your battery.

I’ve checked with a few people that have bought 220V european welders and used them in the US, and they all say they work fine (besides one that broke a few months later from an unrelated issue). As far as I can tell, regardless of whether its half or full phase, the transformer inside still sees the approximately 220V it’s looking for. Have you tested yours on 220V yet?

Assuming the original battery is a li-ion battery and has the same number of cells in series (same voltage), then yes it should charge it. However, looking at the picture of the battery in that listing, I can tell you that is not a picture a 24V 25AH battery. That picture has 6 cells, and a 24V 25AH battery will have something more like 56 cells. That picture looks like a 22V 3AH battery. It could be that they simply used the wrong picture in the listing, though I doubt it as that would be an insanely good price for that size of a battery. but I’d be wary of that offer either way.

i have the exact same BMS but i only have 6 cells, 2p x s3 , i have 2x 3.7v @ 2000 mah batteries in parallel connected to another 2 parallel batteries in series and another parallel pack in series if that makes sense to make a total of 11.1 v @ 12mah for a small project.

I purchased the 220v welder, which obviously was intended to run on non-US half of a phase 220v, Of course we have full single phase 220v, so could you supply me with a hint on how to wire the unit for US 220 v.

To determine how much power you need, you’ll need to determine the voltage you want and the capacity you need to supply that power (voltage times current). Read this article to learn more about calculating your ebike’s power: http://www.ebikeschool.com/myth-ebike-wattage/

Next, grab another 3 cells (or however many you are putting in your parallel groups) and perform the same operation to make another parallel group just like the first one. Then keep going. I’m making eight more parallel groups for a total of 10 parallel groups.

I’ve been reading a bit about how Batterybro.com makes sure to test there batteries are genuine, and how it seems they still get a lot of fake batteries from China. When you buy on Aliexpress.com how to you know and make sure the batteries you buy are genuine? there’s a lot of sellers how did you find yours?

The sense wires generally connect to the positive of each cell group, but sometimes there is one more sense wire than parallel groups because the first sense wire is intended to connect to the negative of the first cell group, then all the subsequent sense wires connect to the positive of each cell group. Each BMS should be labeled on the board to show where each sense wire goes (B1-, B1+, B2+, B3+, etc…)

When it comes to lead acid batteries for ebike use, you’ll generally be looking for what’s called a “sealed lead acid” or SLA battery. SLAs come sealed in a hard plastic case and can be turned in any orientation safely without leaking acid. This makes them appropriate for ebike use. Wet cell lead acid batteries, like many car batteries, would leak dangerous acid if turned on their side or upside down, making them a bad idea for use on an electric bicycle, which is a lot more likely to get knocked over than a car. Remember to stick with SLAs – not wet cell lead acid batteries electric bikes – for electric bicycle use.

For BMS’s, the highest quality ones come from a company called BesTechPower but they are more expensive. I have mostly used BMS’s from AliExpress. I’ve linked to a few examples of BMS’s I’ve used in the article above.

I use white 2mm thick craft foam and cut out a shape slightly larger than my pack. I wrap it up and seal it with electrical tape. It doesn’t have to be pretty, it just has to cover the pack. Your next step will hide the foam from view.

Be warned: some less-than-honest vendors try to pass off nickel plated steel for the pure stuff. They often get away with it because it’s nearly impossible to distinguish between to the two with the naked eye. I wrote a whole article on some methods I developed for testing nickel strip to make sure you get what you paid for. Check it out here.

Do you by any chance have some spare parts you can swap in? A spare controller would you let you know if the controller is faulty and tripping early. Another battery would show you if the problem was battery related.

I don’t know what you mean by saying your battery is 36W, batteries can’t be measured in watts. The only way to know what power your bike needs is to multiply battery voltage by controller current. If you can’t find a marking on your controller that says what its peak current is, you’d have to measure it with an ammeter, like a clamp on DC ammeter that can measure around the battery wire.

The controller that came with my ebike conversion kit just has the label ’48v 1000w’ on it and there are no other specifications anywhere to be seen. I have emailed the suppliers asking if I could have a full list of specifications for the controller but am yet to hear back from them.

Absolutely, a relay is the way to go. Use the keyswitch you bought to activate the relay, then the relay will carry the heavy current flowing through your battery’s positive discharge wire. Alternatively, you could install 9 or 10 of these switches in parallel. Just make sure you mark your keys accordingly 😉

For this tutorial, I’ll be using the green Panasonic 18650PF cells shown above. Lately though I’ve been using 18650GA cells like these, which are a little bit more energy dense, meaning more battery in less space.

Most commercially available 36V packs are around 10Ah, meaning our pack will be just a bit smaller. We could have also gone with a 4p configuration giving us 11.6 Ah, which would have been a slightly bigger and more expensive pack. The final capacity is totally defined by your own needs. Bigger isn’t always better, especially if you’re fitting a battery into tight spaces.

My series connections are between each group of 3 parallel cells. So all the connections that go across the short side of the pack are parallel connections, and all the connections that run along the long end of the pack are series. It doesn’t always happen that way, but the shape of this pack forced that geometry.

In 2012, the future of LiPo in e-bikes looks bright. Most large EV manufacturers are focusing on LiPo as the lithium battery power of the future. LiPo technology is developing fast and becoming safer, more reliable, cheaper, and with a higher life expectancy. Since LiPo cells are being developed to be safer, more efficient and more economical (mostly for main stream products such as the automobile) the electric bicycle industry will be able to piggy-back and utilize the newly available technology at an affordable price. Currently, the latest “best” chemistry involves Manganese-Cobalt which is a lot more stable than the cobalt chemistry of the past.

I have built a few 13s lithium batteries in the past year following your instructions. Thanks. I have taken one of the batteries apart to check its condition as it is the middle of winter here in Winnipeg, Canada. Two parallel sets were out of balance with the rest of the pack. I was wondering if there is a way to use my imax b6 balance chargers to rewire the battery and keep each parallel pack in balance for sure! This way I will bypass the bms. Does this make sense?

The RC roots of LiPo are why they are most frequently sold in flat square foil packets with no protective covers. Hard-case cylindrical cells take up too much volume inside  an RC model (airspace between the round cylinders), and RC builders are free to add as much (or as little) protective housing as they want to the flat foil-packs.

Regarding the soldering of cells: generally it is not recommended as no matter how you do it, a soldering iron will still transfer more heat than a spot welder. That being said, I have seen packs that have been welded using both solid or braided copper wire. I’ve also seen someone use copper wick soldered to the cells terminals. It’s impossible to know exactly how much of an effect that the heat transfer had on the cells but if you don’t mind taking a risk of some level of deterioration of the cells performance, then it technically is possible to solder the cells together.

Battery packs are made up of individual cells connected together. Each cell has a more or less constant voltage dependent on its chemistry. For NiCad/NiMH, this is about 1.2V, for lead acid it is 2.0V, and for lithium cells it is on the order of 3.7V. Typical ebikes and scooters are designed to run on 24, 36, or 48 Volts, so a number of cells have to be series connected into a ‘battery’ that has the desired net voltage. A nominal 36V pack could be made from 10 lithium cells, 18 lead acid cells, or 30 NiMH cells.

For BMS’s, the highest quality ones come from a company called BesTechPower but they are more expensive. I have mostly used BMS’s from AliExpress. I’ve linked to a few examples of BMS’s I’ve used in the article above.

It was an interesting project to say the least, particularly how to link the Ch- and the P- from the BMS taking its B- from the 7s negative termination to the positive of the 6s group, given that there are two routes (i.e. charging and discharging), so connecting both simultaneously would override the function of the BMS.

For a heavy trailer, I’d add a second brushed motor to the cart, whether the bike has a motor or not. You’d only need 24V, and here’s a discussion about powered trailers. The most important thing for going over sand is to have the fattest tires you can fit onto the trailer.

We also maintain stock of replacement vertical seattube batteries that have been in use in the eZee bicycle line since time immemorial. If you have an eZee bike circa 2008-2012 with the Phylion lithium battery pack, you’ll be in for a serious upgrade with over twice the capacity in the same size and weight.

I use white 2mm thick craft foam and cut out a shape slightly larger than my pack. I wrap it up and seal it with electrical tape. It doesn’t have to be pretty, it just has to cover the pack. Your next step will hide the foam from view.

Unless you’ve got a specific design need, it feels to me like the two best value at the moment for a typical E-Bike build are 36v15Ahr and 48v10Ahr. With the choice being LiNiCoMn for smaller/lighter/cheaper or LiFePo for lifespan/higher-C but a bit more heavy/bulky/expensive.

Having built a 13s4p battery to the best of my ability and hooked it up to my 48V 1000W ebike conversion kit…. the lights on the throttle turned on and the wheel spun! Initially I thought the project was a success but after mounting the battery and controller onto the bike and taking the bike for a test spin I ran into a major problem.

As you sugested in one of your articles, using lead acid is a great way to prototype the build, so if I am happy with the performance if not the weight of the lead-acid, I can convert to lithium in the future and save some big weight.

If you have time, I’d be curious to hear about the pros and cons of this kind of approach. Is the main drawback simply the cumulative size of the plastic housing? Or is there some other limitation to this kind of hardware that makes it unsuitable?

I am just trying to install a battery on a velomini http://huntneqip.com that I traded for. I don’t have a problem using the above battery as a hang on battery, but don’t know if it has the BMS in it or if my current charger would charge it. It is pretty cheap.

Remember, if a battery with a certain chemistry can “survive” at 2C, it may actually last much longer if it is sized so that the amp-draw from the controller/motor is only 1C. If it can actually be run at 2C, but it dies in a month with daily use…and yet if sized to run at 1C it lasts a year? Legally the manufacturer is not lying by calling it a 2C battery. There is nothing wrong with that, but…we here want E-bike customers to be aware of the real-world results so they can make an informed decision, and avoid the disappointment that could turn off a lot of potential E-bikers to a wonderful sport and hobby.

So let say main point to count the power is to count the power is to know what type of the controller i have (i have check my batt connection goes to PCB which has sensors it self and whole unicycle controller… ) how to know ? Or in primitive way i can count like my batt is 20A and 36W so max power can be 720W but its peak on continues?

Also, the best method for adding an auxiliary battery would be to connect it when both batteries are full, or at least at similar discharge states. That means the auxiliary battery won’t have to work as hard transferring energy to the internal battery, as they’ll be depleted together at similar rates. And the diode in the auxiliary battery will ensure energy only flows one way (towards the internal battery).

40% grade hills? That’s huge! You’ll definitely want a cell that can perform at high current since you’ll be pulling peak power from those cells to get up those big hills. Something like the Samsung 25R would be a good choice for this application.

Is there same officially recognized method to come up with C ratings? Ping claims 2C on his LiFePo4 batteries, my Chinese-made “BMC” battery claims 3C. Can they just sort of say whatever they want? How do we determine the “real” C rating?

There are formulas out there for calculating the exact size of heat shrink you need but I often find them overly complicated. Here’s how I figure out what size I need: take the height and width of the pack and add them together, and remember that number. The size of heat shrink you need when measured by the flat width (half the circumference) is between that number you found and twice that number (or ideally between slightly more than that number to slightly less than twice that number).

A better and simpler solution would be, as you said, to carry a second battery and just swap the connector from the old battery to the new one when the old battery is depleted. There are a few types of bottle batteries out there, I recommend googling “bottle battery” if you haven’t yet, you’ll likely find a few options. I don’t know if this is the same model as yours, but some common styles similar to your description can be found here and here.

I was wondering, though, if I could use thick gauge wire instead of nickel strips (copper wires are much more accessible). Would there be any downsides to that, given that I’m going to be using solder anyway?

I say this because I am assuming that the wire from the motor that connects to the battery and receives power from the battery would be the same wire that provides power in reverse to the battery when regenerative breaking. With this particular BMS, would it require a different wire to do the regenerative braking?

The other thing to consider is that if you have one 48-volt 10-Ah battery putting out a measly 20 amps, you can add a second version of the same battery, wire them together in parallel, and you will have a 20-Ah pack with a 40-amp capacity, thus effectively doubling your range and doubling your amp output performance.

Dang, I just realized what I did wrong. I had been thinking as I connected the sense lines it was arbitrary which end of the battery was B1 and which B13, but obviously it isn’t. B1 has to be the negative end and B13 has to be the positive end. Since I already cut the sense lines to length, I’ll need to put my replacement BMS on the opposite end of the pack.

The Panasonic NCR18650B cells you have are very good quality cells. I used similar cells also made by Panasonic, but mine are the NCR18650PF (not B). The difference is that yours have more capacity (mine are 2900mAh, yours 3400mAh) but yours have a lower constant current draw rating. I don’t remember what it is off the top of my head, but I don’t think it’s much more than 5A per cell. So just make sure that you either use enough cells in parallel and/or limit your controller to not draw more power than the cells can handle. Check the cell specification sheet which you can find on Google somewhere to ensure that you are staying within the cells’ limit.

I finally made it happen on BMS #3 (the unfortunate thing about AliExpress is that every dumb mistake that kills a part is another month added to the project) and the battery seems to work great, though it only has a couple miles so far.

Lithium Ion electric bike batteries are ideal for those that plan to ride longer distances and or more frequent trips. The commuters dream battery, lithium batteries can stand two complete 100% discharges a day for years. Discharging the battery half way riding to work or school, then parking all day at half charge does no damage to a lithium electric bike battery. So the urgency to recharge immediately is not like SLA’s. Since discharging to 100% empty does not significantly harm lithium electric bike batteries, the usable range of the lithium electric bike battery is roughly double that of SLA’s. In typical electric bike use, Li-Ion batteries last from two to four years. Proper storage of Lithium Ion batteries is important when the electric bike will not be used for more than a few weeks. Unplug the battery from the electric bike, charge fully, and then store in a cool but not frozen, dry place.

A recent quote from ES member SamTexas on claimed max C-rates: “…I have in front of me Samsung’s own Nickel (Manganese) 18650 cells….I have tested these cells at 3C continuous and they do deliver full capacity at that rate. Push it to 5C and they become hot and capacity is greatly reduced…“

I would prefer to go with lithium, but I have a couple of 75 volt (i think) cells from a UPS that are brand new. They are built from regular 12v (sixteen total) sealed lead units and would make the initial investment in an ebike that much more reasonable. One huge downside is that I hope to use the folding ebike in my homebuilt aircraft. As with ebikes, excess weight is to be avoided!

Hi Danl, that sounds like a very high power motor. Most consumer ebikes are in the 36V-48V range, so if your motor is advertised as being rated for those higher voltages then it’s definitely a more serious motor. If you’re looking for a ready-built and relatively inexpensive battery, then something like this might work for you, though I haven’t personally used that battery. You can of course build your own battery just like I did in this article, and that way you’ll be sure to get exactly what you’re looking for. The AH’s required will depend on the quality of the battery. A batter rated for higher current will require fewer AH’s than a lower quality battery. I’d aim for at least 20AH, if not more on a motor of that size. It’s going to eat your battery quickly, so you’ll want more capacity to be able to ride longer.

To wire the BMS, we first need to determine which of the sense wires (the many thin wires) is the first one (destined for the first parallel group). Look for the wires to be numbered on one side the board. Mine is on the backside of the board and I forgot to take a picture of it before installing it, but trust me that I took note of which end the sense wires start on. You don’t want to make a mistake and connect the sense wires starting in the wrong direction.

LiFePO4-Lithium Iron Phosphate. This was the first lithium chemistry that really took off for use in cordless drills and laptop computers. Mass production brought the prices down, and E-bikers began buying cordless drill packs and gutting them for the cylindrical cells, so they could be re-configured from the stock 18V up to 48V (or more). The common low C-rate was around 1C, so builders began making packs for high voltage to get better performance without stressing the pack by trying to pull high amps. LiFePO4 requires a sophisticated Battery-Management-System (BMS) to stay healthy.

The eZee flat packs are one of the nicer rear rack battery options that we’ve dealt with, featuring a locking on/off key switch, and a rail system to slide into the eZee double-decker rack or attach with our more universal CNC battery anchors. They hold up to 70 cells, allowing for both a 36V 19Ah (10s 7p) and 48V 14Ah (13s 5p) options. The 36V pack has UN38.3 certification for air shipping, and can handle up to 40A motor controllers fine, while the 48V pack shouldn’t be used above 25A.

Lithium battery: 36V. Motor: 250W high speed brushless gear motors. Type: Mountain Bicycle. Front Fork: High-strength carbon steel comfort shock absorption. Tire: High quality lithium tire. Charger: S…

For BMS’s, the highest quality ones come from a company called BesTechPower but they are more expensive. I have mostly used BMS’s from AliExpress. I’ve linked to a few examples of BMS’s I’ve used in the article above.

And if you don’t want to purchase my book (or you already have a lot of ebike knowledge), you can still support this site by simply clicking on this link before you shop on Aliexpress. Basically, that’s batteries for electric bike affiliate link that shows Aliexpress that you came to them via my site. It doesn’t effect you at all, but if you make a purchase, this site will get a small percentage of the profit that Aliexpress makes. It’s a simple way to help support this site so I can pay the hosting and keep providing more free info (and to keep this site free of annoying ads). I have some of those affiliate links on a limited number of articles on my site. When I personally buy and test products that I find to be a combination of great quality and great prices, like these batteries, for example, I like to share them through those affiliate links. Again, it costs you nothing, but it allows me to keep cranking out more info and content for you guys!

If you want to step up a notch on the quality ladder, here is another good charger that I prefer even more, though it’s a bit more expensive: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/aluminum-shell-36V-42V-2Amper-Li-ion-Lipo-battery-charger-high-quality-charger-for-10S-li/1680408_32275847257.html

I say this because I am assuming that the wire from the motor that connects to the battery and receives power from the battery would be the same wire that provides power in reverse to the battery when regenerative breaking. With this particular BMS, would it require a different wire to do the regenerative braking?

The 48V, 8AH lithium battery of this ebike is removable. Material: Aluminium alloy frame. E-bike & Assisted bicycle, you can choose the E-bike to enjoy a long time travel, and also exercise. Combining…

Next, regarding your question of paralleling the batteries. Yes, you can parallel them, and you can do it even before connecting to the controller. The biggest safety issue (and damage issue) though is to always be sure they are at the exact same voltage when you connect the two batteries in parallel. The easiest way to do this is only to connect them in parallel when you’re sure they are both fully charged.

The battery cells have now been assembled into a larger 36V pack, but I still have to add a BMS to control the charging and discharging of the pack. The BMS monitors all of the parallel groups in the pack to safely cut off power at the end of charging, balance all the cells identically and keep the pack from being over-discharged.

Manufacturers usually rate their cells’ capacity at very low discharge rates, sometimes just 0.1c, where the cells perform at their maximum. So don’t be surprised if you’re only getting 95% or so of the advertised capacity of your cells during real world discharges. That’s to be expected. Also, your capacity is likely to go up a bit after the first few charge and discharge cycles as the cells get broken in and balance to one another.

Actually I have ran into a problem – a few days ago I was riding it up a hill on a hot day when the power cut off and it wouldn’t start again. When I tried to charge it, the light on the charger just flickered from green to orange. I took out the battery and found that one of the cells had corroded from what looks like overheating. I think that the battery pack failure was most likely caused by too much of a load applied to the battery pack.

my questions are obviously related to sla’s as this is what i have now but if answers differ according to battery chemistry i would like to know this as well for future reference any info much appreciated cheers craig

Your battery pack size is based on voltage and amp-hours. The higher the voltage and the higher the amp hours of your battery, the more range your battery will give you. A 48V 10-Ah pack gives you 480 watt hour (48 X 10). This gives you an easy way to determine exactly how much battery you are buying. The wattage of a battery is the only accurate determinant to judge what range your finished ebike will have.

Have a plan on where you are going to charge your bike before settling on a battery chemistry. If you live in a crowded apartment building and the only place you have to charge is in your living room floor, you may want to decide against any of these lithium technologies.

If you want a LiPo battery pack, one of your better choices if you want to save money and have a lot of output amps is build one of your own from a Hobby King packs. This requires a lot of time and knowledge, not only in building the pack but also in managing it.  LiPo batteries can be extremely dangerous and prone to burst into fire if not assembled with a lot of precautions (BMS) and cared for properly.

Actually, it is not recommended to use protected cells in ebike builds. There a few reasons but the main ones are 1) unreliability of the protection circuit, 2) many points of failure, and 3) lower discharge current of individual cell protection circuits.

However, the description says The monolithic 12V batteries do not have any PCM (any electronics) inside. They consist of finely balanced cells with identical perfomace. The battery must be managed as a single monolithic 12V block.

Its low C-rate of 1C means you need a large pack if you want higher amps. Justin at ebikes.ca was an early adopter of LiMn for his E-bikes because his customers wanted a trouble-free product that wasn’t fussy and lasted a long time. Makita cordless tools use LiMn, as do many laptop computers. Last year Zero E-motorcycles were using LiMnO2, but this year they moved up to NMC (found listed below). [edit: Due to customer desires and safety concerns, LiMn has been improved and now in 2014, there are high current LiMn]

I am not sure their interests align with mine. I would happily live with 1500 recharge cycles () by which time i would be sick of it anyway) instead of 2000 if I could use 3c in or out when urgently needed.

Hi Sundaram, I’m not aware of many 18650 LiFePO4 cells, are you sure you are using that chemistry instead of standard lithium ion? Perhaps can you provide a little more detail about the specific cells you’re using?

It’s best to try and match the cells as closely as possible based on capacity by using a lithium cell tester like this one. If you plan on using the battery you build for a high drain application, different current ratings will be more of an issue. If you have many cells in parallel and will only pull low current from each one, then different current ratings are less of an issue. It’s always best to use perfectly matched cells, though I know that’s not the cheapest option and is outside of the budget for many.

A High-performance Motor acheives a top speed of 20-30km/h with a range of 20km means your ebike commute just got easier. Power: Under 500W. Material: Aluminum Alloy. Outdoor Foldable Electric Power A…

I then put one set of welds on each cell end of the first parallel group, effectively tacking the three nickel strips in place. Then I added another set of welds on each of the negative terminals of the second parallel group. This gave me 6 weld sets, or one weld set for each cell. Lastly, I followed up those single weld sets with another couple welds per cell to ensure good contact and connection.

A cell that provides close to a “real world” 2.8-Ah per 18650 cell is pretty impressive, and the 3C current-producing capability is perfect for E-bikes (a 15-Ah pack can provide a continuous 45A, and our favorite power level of 30A can be provided by a very small 10-Ah pack). If you know of anyone who builds a pack out of these, please contact us, as we are very keen to discover whatever strengths or weaknesses they may have. If you are shopping to buy these, make certain you get these specific part numbers, because similar part numbers will only have half the C-rate.

Remove all metallic jewelry. This is another tip that I can give from experience. Arcing the contacts on your battery is not something you want to happen ever, and especially not against your bare skin. I’ve had it happen on my wedding ring and once even had a burn mark in the shape of my watch’s clasp on my wrist for a week. Now I take everything off.

I don’t think there is any danger to parallel more than 4 cells. Tesla cars have literally hundreds of 18650 cells just like these paralleled. The issue is that if you ever did have a problem with one cell, like a factory defect that caused it to short circuit, it could die and drag all the other cells down with it, killing the entire parallel group. That’s why Tesla uses individual cell fusing, but that’s not really employed on the small scale like for ebikes.

This makes sense. Yes, it would be possible. You could wire balance connectors and extra discharge plugs to make three packs out of your one 13s pack, such as two 6s packs and a 1s, or two 5s packs and a 3s, etc. Then you’d charge each one, one at at time, using your imax B6 charger. It would take a while, but that’s how you’d do it. Just be careful to not get your connectors batteries for electric scooters canada as you’ll have three sets of balance wires and three sets of discharge wires.

In many situations, especially if you are replacing a battery pack on an existing setup, the voltage is defined by the controller electronics and cannot be readily changed. Otherwise, the voltage determines the maximum speed at which your vehicle will travel, and you have a degree of freedom in selecting the voltage to meet your performance expectations. If you know the volts/rpm for the motor, then it is straightforward to calculate how fast it will go for a given voltage. Select a value that gives an unloaded speed of about 20% greater than your desired cruising speed for best performance.

If you are upgrading or replacing an existing battery pack, it is always safe to replace it with a battery that has the same nominal voltage. If you have an 36V ebike setup that is not from us, and are looking to ‘upgrade’ to a 48V/52V pack, more often than not you can do this without damaging the existing electronics. That is because most 36V motor controllers use 60V rated mosfets and 63V rated capacitors, and so even a fully charged 52V battery will not exceed these values.

I figured this would be a critical step I wouldn’t want to mess up. Thanks for the advice on using the multimeter. That’s good to know as I thought I might need to open up the controller and see which wires went where on that male xlr connection which I guess would be an option too. Thanks again!

But what if you didn’t have to compromise? What if you could build your own ebike battery to your exact specifications? What if you could build a battery the perfect size for your bike, with all of the features you want, and do it for cheaper than retail? It’s easier than you think, and I’ll show you how below.

$Xport 350W 7 Speed Electric Bike Features: 350W motor, Samsung Lithium Battery 3 Riding Modes: Electric (Throttle, 3 speed), Electric with Pedal, Pedal Only Spec: Motor: 350W Battery: 24V Samsung Lit…

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Now I’ve got all of my pack sealed in heat shrink with my wires exiting the seam between the two layers of shrink wrap. I could have stopped here, but I didn’t particularly like the way the shrink fell on the wire exit there, from a purely aesthetic standpoint. So I actually took a third piece of shrink wrap, the same size (285 mm) as that first piece and went around the long axis of the pack one more time to pull the wires down tight to the end of the pack.

Next, we’ll need to wire multiple 18650 cells in parallel to reach our desired pack capacity. Each of the cells I’m using are rated at 2,900 mAh. I plan to put 3 cells in parallel, for a combined capacity of 2.9Ah x 3 cells = 8.7 Ah. The industry abbreviation for parallel cells is ‘p’, meaning that my final pack configuration is considered a “10S3P pack” with a final specification of 36V 8.7AH.

I just found your article, and as if it were destiny, this is exactly what I am trying to do (build a battery pack with BMS, and charge with charger). I am new to this, however, and have a question or two…

In general, the size and cost of a cell will scale directly with its amp-hour capacity. To a first order, twice the amp-hours would mean twice the size, twice the weight, and twice the cost. In practice this deviates a little due to different packing densities and production scales, but it’s usually pretty close. For instance, the familiar ‘AA’ NiMH has about 2 Ah, a ‘C’ cell has 4 Ah, a ‘D’ cell is about 8Ah, the large ‘F’ cells are 12-13 Ah, and double-D cells are 18-19Ah.

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I’m a little worried that your batteries aren’t what you think they are. If they really are AA sized, which is rare in the lithium battery world, then they are not 3,000 mAh. Next, 10 cells in series is going to give you 36V, which is twice what your 18V drill is rated for. 5 cells in series and 2 in parallel would be a better method. I usually recommend a BMS but you can skip it if you have another way of diligently monitoring your cell voltages and then charging using an RC style balance charger like an iMaxB6 charger through an JST-XH connector.

3. Sealed Lead-Acid Shrink Wrapped Sealed Lead-Acid batteries may look like Shrink-Wrapped Li-Ion batteries, but they are heavier and do not last as long. View Shrink Wrapped Sealed Lead-Acid E-Bike Batteries

The watts (power) the battery can provide is totally dependent on the type of cells and the BMS rating. So until I know more about your cells, I can’t help you. But for an example, imagine you used cells that were rated at 5A each. 7p x 5A = 35A total power capacity. 35A * 24V = 840 watts, the total amount of power your battery can handle. But now let’s assume you used a 20A BMS, meaning the BMS can only handle 20A continuously. That’s your limiting factor, so your new total battery maximum power is 20A * 24V = 480 watts. Now just substitute the actual current rating of your cells and BMS to solve for your battery’s power capacity.

Hi Micah, thank you for your advice. I am not going to touch that battery. I know this may be a lot to ask, but would you build me a battery for my velomini 1 ? It doesn’t have to be the one that fits in the frame, I could put it in a bag and hang it on the handlebars or something. If more convenient you can email me directly at dlimjr at yahoo. My sincere thanks and may you and your family have a happy holiday.. Don, San Francisco

Lipo batteries are currently the “hottest” battery choice for electric bike enthusiasts. LiPo batteries are the most power-dense type of  battery available to electric bike riders today. The problem is that LiPo battery packs for e-bikes are hard to find, especially one with high output if you are building a racing bike for riding off road.

I want to use my two 4Ah Ryobi lithium batteries 18volts in series for 36 volts. I have a charger for them , they use 15 batteries each so 30 total, they are $50 each. This seems similar to your 36v build for about $3 each so $90 total, plus a spot welder for $1oo. I want to get a 38v/750 48v/1000w rear motor recommended from your web site from aliexpress. Do you think that these will work for my bicycle?

To calculate the max amps the battery can deliver, you have to know the max amps of the cells you used. For example, Panasonic 18650pf cells can deliver 10A continuous, and I used 3 cells in series in this battery, so the battery can deliver 3 x 10A = 30A. However, you also need to know how much current the BMS can deliver. If I put a 15A continous BMS on this pack then that would be the “weakest link” so to speak, meaning the pack with the BMS could only deliver 15A continuous.

Maybe another way forward is to buy a pannier mounted supplementary battery pack (a proper one with a BMS) and to install it in parallel with the main one. The question then becomes whether to connect between the sprung terminals that go to the motor controller (which I believe to be the best thing to do) or into the little charging port jack. I presume that the charging port is connected to the charging side of the BMS and I don’t know how much current that port would take or whether it’s even a good plan to charge and discharge the main battery at the same time. I see significant potential for a high current through that small jack once I discharge via the main battery and a voltage difference exists between the supplementary batter and the main battery.

Well, you’re right that I wouldn’t recommend it! I admire your ingenuity but there are a couple big issues with this setup: 1) You have 4 groups of 10 series cells but no way to balance between them. The 4 cells need to be paralled before they are wired in series otherwise they will get increasingly out of balance with each charge/discharge cycle. 2) I’m not sure you’d get a good enough contact from a copper spring or busbar that is just held on the end of the cells in compression. The copper will also corrode over time and caused increase resistance at the point it touches the cells and problems down the road.

I did not intend for the timeline to reflect anything other than what I recall seeing as E-bike battery packs. Some chemistries have been around a long time before they were used by a significant number of E-bikers.

If you are concerned about the speed and power of an electric bike, pay attention to the motor size. Electric motor size is measured in watts and usually ranges between 250 and 750. When deciding on the appropriate amount of wattage, think about factors like the weight of the rider and the desired speed and terrain for the bike. If your child will mostly be on a flat surface, lower wattage should suffice; if they are planning to ride up and down hills, look for a bike with a larger motor.

Really nice article you made here. very helpful. I do have some questions about the BMS board you used. Would you know where I could find any type of schematic for it because im trying to see whether I can use more then one of those BMS boards on one pack

That’s exactly correct. You’d start by welding 10 parallel groups of 4 cells each, then you’d connect those 10 parallel groups in series to make one rectangular battery. I’ve done many 10s4p packs just like that for 36V 10ah ebike batteries.

I also don’t have a spot welder, and for the purpose of building a single 16S2P pack, I’m not sure I want to splurge on that extra $100+. I do have a whole tub of flux and a temperature-controlled soldering iron, so I’ll be attempting to solder the cells instead (extra hot and fast with lots of flux to avoid conducting too much heat into the battery internals from dwell time).

Now I’ve got all of my pack sealed in heat shrink with my wires exiting the seam between the two layers of shrink wrap. I could have stopped here, but I didn’t particularly like the way the shrink fell on the wire exit there, from a purely aesthetic standpoint. So I actually took a third piece of shrink wrap, the same size (285 mm) as that first piece and went around the long axis of the pack one more time to pull the wires down tight to the end of the pack.

The higher C-rate of 3C for the newer LiFePO4 (from A123) keeps these popular so you don’t need a huge pack to get fairly adequate amps. To get a continuous 24A, you’d only need a 8-Ah battery. Fairly affordable, and small enough to fit in a bike frame.

The Panasonic 18650pf is a good cell, that’s the one I used here. I also like the Samsung 26F, though it’s a fairly low power cell, and the Samsung 29E which is a bit higher power cell. The Samsung 30Q is a fairly new cell that has good specifications but doesn’t have as long a life – everything is a trade-off.

Be warned: some less-than-honest vendors try to pass off nickel plated steel for the pure stuff. They often get away with it because it’s nearly impossible to distinguish between to the two with the naked eye. I wrote a whole article on some methods I developed for testing nickel strip to make sure you get what you paid for. Check it out here.

Scooter / Light Bike. For Electric Bike Bicycle EBIKE (Conversion Type) amp Lithium Ion BATTERY. Bicycle Accessories. Case Material： ABS Aluminium alloy. Bike bag. Li-ion E-Bike Battery. Car & Truck P…

9S, 32.85VDC, 2890MAH, 94.93WH. THE ENERGY DENSITY OF THESE CELLS ARE SPECTACULAR. YOU GET A POSITIVE AND NEGATIVE LEAD WIRE AND ALSO BALANCE CONNECTORS IF YOU WANT TO BALANCE THE CELLS. IF YOU BUILD …

A better and simpler solution would be, as you said, to carry a second battery and just swap the connector from the old battery to the new one when the old battery is depleted. There are a few types of bottle batteries out there, I recommend googling “bottle battery” if you haven’t yet, you’ll likely find a few options. I don’t know if this is the same model as yours, but some common styles similar to your description can be found here and here.

2. Lithium-Ion Shrink Wrapped Shrink Wrapped Lithium-Ion Batteries are housed in a soft PVC heatshrink material. It protects the battery from moisture and short-circuits, but not from being dropped or punctured. View Shrink Wrapped Lithium E-Bike Batteries

My series connections are between each group of 3 parallel cells. So all the connections that go across the short side of the pack are parallel connections, and all the connections that run along the long end of the pack are series. It doesn’t always happen that way, but the shape of this pack forced that geometry.

Also changing the fuse to a higher one could cause the wires to start a fire and the whole house would burn down if the wires are not thick enough. Also in sweden a fuse gets bigger as they are rated higher so you can fit a 20A fuse in a 10A slot, for safety.

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Actually, the protected cells aren’t a great option for ebike packs. The protection circuit on every cell can overcomplicate things, not to mention that it usually isn’t rated to handle the same current the cell could without a protection circuit.

Great for DIY e-bike and powerwall builders, t ake them apart and put them all together in series in other projects and get extreme power out batteries electric scooter what you build! These batteries are made with TWENTY (2…

Ideally, I would buy a battery with the same type of connection and just carry the spare one unconnected and swap them over but I don’t seem to be able to find the type of battery case for sale anywhere. It’s a quick release bottle type battery that has two sprung terminals about half inch in diameter that contact with two large terminals on what I think must be the motor controller integrated into the bottom of the bottle mounting bracket.

BesTechPower makes some of the best BMS’s in the industry. You pay for that quality, but I believe it is well worth it. I haven’t used that specific BMS you linked to, so I can’t give you specific feedback on it. I haven’t done very many 7s packs, as that’s on the lower end for ebike use. The few I’ve done had some cheaper BMS’s and not the two wire design I mentioned. Sorry I don’t have any specific recommendations for you – it’s just a lower voltage level that I don’t often use.

When you buy your battery, make sure you know what its maximum amp output is. Remember, by multiplying amps and voltage you get the actual current capacity of the battery. For example a 48-volt 25 amp pack can put out 1200 watts.

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This is the old technology for e-bikes that is heavy as bricks and does not have longevity. Lead acid will double the weight of your electric bike. Unless you have to because of money restraints, we advise to steer way clear of lead acid batteries.  Your bike will have a completely different feel and range if you spend the money on one of the new lithium technologies.

Hi Jonathon. You’d need a female XLR cable for the discharge port on your new battery (so it can plug into your Porteur’s charge port) and you’d need a second XLR connector, this time a male, for the charge port of your new battery. That way you could use your original Porteur’s charger to charge both batteries.

hi i was considering adding a second set of batteries to my ebike in parallel to double the range but heared on a thread somewhere that this can damage/overload the controller which i suspect is a load of tosh but can anyone confirm/clarify this as i assumed the amp hour capacity was just that and the max amp output was just that, the maximum that can be drained at once, my understanding is it doesnt matter what amp hr the pack is as the amps drawn into the controller is governed by the demands of the motor which wont change if i have 2 packs connected.

2. Lithium-Ion Shrink Wrapped Shrink Wrapped Lithium-Ion Batteries are housed in a soft PVC heatshrink material. It protects the battery from moisture and short-circuits, but not from being dropped or punctured. View Shrink Wrapped Lithium E-Bike Batteries

Lithium batteries made specially for ebikes often come with specific bicycle mounting points making them easy to bolt to the bike frame, seat post or rear rack. If you go with a different type of lithium battery without ebike specific mounts, you’ll likely have to put it in a bag on the bike, which is still a good option, and one that I even prefer sometimes. (Link to blog post of mine about center frame triangle batteries).

When it comes to layout, there are two ways to assemble cells in straight packs (rectangular packs like I am building). I don’t know if there are industry terms for this, but I call the two methods “offset packing” and “linear packing”.

Regarding the cell question, its a mixture of both. Cheap ebikes use cheap cells. You can bet the Sonders ebike had the cheapest cells available. Name brand ebikes usually use Samsung cells, but sometimes LG and occasionally Panasonic cells can be found in name brand ebikes (the Panasonics are some of the most expensive and so they are rarer). That being said, I’ve seen some shadier internet sites selling high quality (and genuine) Samsung/Panasonic packs, and I’ve seen some nice ebikes with some no-name cells. You should always check with the vendor/manufacturer if you want to ensure you’re getting good cells. Unfortunately, it can be hard to verify the cells yourself though without voiding the warranty, as they are usually sealed under shrink wrap. A good vendor will be happy to confirm the cells for you ahead of time and may even be able to show you some pictures of opened packs to verify.

This had led me to believe that if there is too much load being exerted on the bike (i.e. the current being drawn from the battery is too high) then either the BMS or the controller trips and cuts out. However I am reluctant to believe that the BMS is causing the trouble as it has a 40A rating on it (this link shows batteries for electric scooters replacement exact BMS) http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Electric-motor-car-13S-48V-40A-BMS-lithium-ion-battery-BMS-Used-for-48V-20Ah-30Ah/32484213150.html?spm=2114.13010608.0.62.evx6sX .

HERE ARE 100 GENIUNE LG LGDAS31865 18650 2200MAH CELLS. YOU CAN’T FIND A BETTER DEAL THAN THIS. Capacity: 2200mAh. THE PHOTOS SHOW HOW WE GET THESE IN AND BREAK THEM DOWN. STOP GETTING RIPPED OFF AND …

The BMS is for 7S, I connect B1+, B2+, B3+, to the negative of the first serie. B4+ is connected to the positive of the first serie, B5+ positive of 2nd serie, B6+ positive of 3rd serie, B7+ positive of 4rd serie.

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For discharge wires you’ll want something bigger, like 14 awg silicone wire. 12 awg would be better but might be overkill for your use. For charge wires, 16 awg silicone wire would be fine and you could probably get away with 18 awg silicone wire.

BMS’s aren’t required, they just make life easier. As you mentioned, if you don’t use a BMS then you’ve got to diligently monitor your cells and use balance charging to manually balance your cells. A BMS just takes care of this hassle for you. A low quality BMS can cause problems, but good quality BMS’s shouldn’t risk cell damage.

That is definitely possible, but keep in mind that the 10 modules you want to connect in series will only need one wire between them. You don’t need to connect the negative and positive of each to the next – you only need a wire from the positive of module 1 to the negative of module 2, then a wire from the positive of module 2 to the negative of module 3 and so on.

In general, the size and cost of a cell will scale directly with its amp-hour capacity. To a first order, twice the amp-hours would mean twice the size, twice the weight, and twice the cost. In practice this deviates a little due to different packing densities and production scales, but it’s usually pretty close. For instance, the familiar ‘AA’ NiMH has about 2 Ah, a ‘C’ cell has 4 Ah, a ‘D’ cell is about 8Ah, the large ‘F’ cells are 12-13 Ah, and double-D cells are 18-19Ah.

When soldering these wires to the nickel strip, try to solder between two cells and not directly on top of a cell. This keeps the heat source further from the actual cell ends and causes less heating of the battery cells.

Thank you for the article! I am currently making a battery for an electronic skateboard, so I need the layout to be as thin as possible to allow ample room underneath the deck. Currently, I have 6 packs of 3 cells welded in parallel, and would eventually like to create a battery which is 9 cells long, 1 wide, and 2 high, for 18 in total (the two packs of nine would then be welded in series). I am wondering if I could be able to make 2 battery packs by welding 3 of my current 3 cell packs together in parallel to make a long, yet skinny pack, and then welding both packs of nine in series using the alternating system. Essentially, I would be creating a pack that would look like 3 of the ones you show above when making your first series connection. Let me know what you think, and thank you!

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 An electric bike battery is a power storage medium for use with electric bikes and electric trikes. An electric bike battery can be a lead battery, or a lithium type battery similar to those in laptops, or cordless power tools. A lead electric bike battery is usually of the type called SLA, which stands for sealed lead acid. A lithium electric bike battery may be one of several types. The most commonly used lithium electric bike battery types today are Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4 or Life) or Lithium Nickel Manganese Cobalt Oxide (LiNiMnCoO2 or NMC). The E-Bikekit lithium electric bike battery is a Lithium Nickel Manganese Cobalt Oxide type battery. Considering the size and weight difference between LFP and Li-NMC, all lithium packs are Lithium-Ion, but not all are the same energy density – LiFePO-4 batteries are larger and heavier than Li-NMC.

I use my welders on 220V, though 110V versions are available. If you have access to 220V in your home (many 110V countries have 220V lines for clothes dryers and other high power appliances) then I’d recommend sticking with 220V. In my experience the 110V models seem to have more problems than their 220V brothers. Your mileage may vary.

The battery pack is one of the defining aspects of any PEV project; by and large it determines the weight, range, and cost of the vehicle. For these reasons a solid understanding of the various battery types is more than a little useful.

Next, regarding your question of paralleling the batteries. Yes, you can parallel them, and you can do it even before connecting to the controller. The biggest safety issue (and damage issue) though is to always be sure they are at the exact same voltage when you connect the two batteries in parallel. The easiest way to do this is only to connect them in parallel when you’re sure they are both fully charged.

Regarding that welder, I’ve used it on a 20A circuit but I don’t own it (it belongs to a friend of mine) so I can’t give you the best firsthand experience as I’ve only used it at his place on a 20A circuit. My welders, which are similar but a slightly earlier model, are run on a 20A circuit at my home. I live in Israel and we have 220V wiring at home like in Europe, so I can’t tell you for sure how it will work on 110V. If there is the option of running it off 220V in your garage or laundry room, that could be another option, but I’ve heard of people running on 110V in the US without problems so I can’t say for sure. Sorry I’m not more help on that front.

I have built a few 13s lithium batteries in the past year following your instructions. Thanks. I have taken one of the batteries apart to check its condition as it is the middle of winter here in Winnipeg, Canada. Two parallel sets were out of balance with the rest of the pack. I was wondering if there is a way to use my imax b6 balance chargers to rewire the battery and keep each parallel pack in balance for sure! This way I will bypass the bms. Does this make sense?

Nakto/SPARK ebikes are certificated with CE, EN15194, TUV, EMC, RoHS,EPAC. High Speed Motor:it is 250Watt high performance brushless motor,powerful and fast, the Max speed can be easy to 20Mile/h, sui…

BMS’s aren’t required, they just make life easier. As you mentioned, if you don’t use a BMS then you’ve got to diligently monitor your cells and use balance charging to manually balance your cells. A BMS just takes care of this hassle for you. A low quality BMS can cause problems, but good quality http://huntneqip.com shouldn’t risk cell damage.

Unless you’ve got a specific design need, it feels to me like the two best value at the moment for a typical E-Bike build are 36v15Ahr and 48v10Ahr. With the choice being LiNiCoMn for smaller/lighter/cheaper or LiFePo for lifespan/higher-C but a bit more heavy/bulky/expensive.

These cells are distinctive due to their cylindrical shape and are about the size of a finger. Depending on the size of the battery you plan to build, you’ll need anywhere from a few dozen to a few hundred of them.

LiFePO4/Lithium Ion/Lead Acid 120W Battery EBike Charger. 12V6A,24V3A,36V2.5A,48V2A;  Li-Ion Battery Charge Voltage = 4.2V x the number of cells in series; LiFePO4 Battery Charge Voltage = 3.55V x the number of cells in series.

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I use white 2mm thick craft foam and cut out a shape slightly larger than my pack. I wrap it up and seal it with electrical tape. It doesn’t have to be pretty, it just has to cover the pack. Your next step will hide the foam from view.

If not possible, try charging them individually. Some of them might come back but others might be dead. The tricky thing is that they will likely not be able to deliver their full capacity anymore and the actual capacity will likely vary from cell to cell. Two year old cells at a very low voltage are quite a gamble.

Once you’ve got 2-3 welds on the top of each cell, turn the 3 cells over and do the same thing to the bottom of the 3 cells with a new piece of nickel. Once you’ve completed the bottom welds you’ll have one complete parallel group, ready to go. This is technically a 1S3P battery already (1 cell in series, 3 cells in parallel). That means I’ve just created a 3.6V 8.7Ah battery. Only nine more of these and I’ll have enough to complete my entire pack.

Capacity: 30Ah. output: 71.4V 5A. Lifecycle of single cell: >85% capacity after 700 cycles, > 70% capacity after 800 cycles. (<1C discharge rate and <1C charge rate). Lifecycle: > 85% capacity after 5…